Attendances at the CNG

Did anyone see a fascinating interview with John McDermott in the YEP yesterday: full page job. John's main concern was with attendances, and said playing at home was 'like an away game'. Ouch.
The club hierarchy are clearly concerned. I guess at some point Irving may start to wonder if the game is worth the candle, if attendances don't pick up.
Its a real problem: how on earth do we lift the crowds beyond about 300/400? To be fair the club have tried everything: free admission, signing quality players, getting Town on live TV etc. etc. Wish I knew the answer.

Poor form at home over 20 points lost at home to teams we should have beaten, we have played better away this season ut what concerns me is when you look around at our home crowed you see the same faces who have been going for the last 30 years or so "the hardcore" what you don't see is young supporters why? they are the future of this club as with any club and they should be embraced, the club needs to go out and do some market research and ask people if they go and if not why,it would be interesting to know why young people would rather walk around the town aimlessly on a Saturday than go watch town play

Here it is.

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rangerider wrote:Poor form at home over 20 points lost at home to teams we should have beaten, we have played better away this season ut what concerns me is when you look around at our home crowed you see the same faces who have been going for the last 30 years or so "the hardcore" what you don't see is young supporters why? they are the future of this club as with any club and they should be embraced, the club needs to go out and do some market research and ask people if they go and if not why,it would be interesting to know why young people would rather walk around the town aimlessly on a Saturday than go watch town play

I'd say there is a small group of lads who like a good chant behind the goal, very approachable lot, made a flag for the Hastings game. But there just simply isn't enough of them, the board really need to look at going into High schools, perhaps take over a P.E lesson and try and get some of the players to have a game of football with them, then afterwards give them some type of special offer to try and get them into the ground.

Another point is the FIFA game for the Xbox and playstation, it's good they want to play more and more football but im concerned its getting to a point where some people would rather a game on there then outside!

I suspect this conversation is being had on almost every non-league forum at the moment. Attendances bumping along at subsistence-level or below, and the majority of faces in the crowd belonging to the over-40s. There are obvious exceptions at all Steps, but the only really well-supported ones seem to be the Phoenix-Clubs like Halifax, Chester etc., who may just be 'passing through' anyway.
Having moved north (from Oxford ) just about a year ago I've watched HT on quite a number of occasions now, and generally enjoyed what I've seen, but despite the reasonable size of some of the crowds (better than OCFC can muster much of the time!), because of, shall we say, the average age of the supporters it's all a bit quiet. Just the sort of problem that has been discussed many times on the OCFC forum over the last three/four years: "...crowd like a library!")
Perhaps Oxford and Harrogate are both a bit too genteel!?
Also as at Oxford - and lots of other clubs as well - good numbers come through the gates when there's a cup-run going, but then disappear when it's back to the routine league fixtures. How do you get all those 'floaters' to turn out on a regular basis?

I'm afraid I don't think there is an answer to the problem, at least not a relatively simple one, or surely someone on one of the many hard-working committees at the clubs would have come up with the solution by now?

Today's game? Tricky one to call: I suspect it'll be a draw. And I rather think I won't get to see OCFC at Wetherby Road next season: either because HT have been promoted via the play-offs; or City have moved to the BSB South

Well the Hinckley game proved there is a bit of an appetite in the Harrogate area...|I think if the pitch had been like a bowling green and the weather a bit dryer we would have got the gates up slightly. Defiantly approaching schools is the way forward and working closely with local football clubs. Perhaps a little more advertising may help, and maybe target the single women with children too....I have heard single women whilst taking my children to school having a little grumble that their kids want to go to a football match but they just think football matches are full of drunk yobs.

Take the Leeds United approach in my opinion. They give tickets to schools to then reward to students who are doing well academically. It makes the tickets something to earn rather than just giving them out and when given out after working hard to achieve them children are more likely to nag their parents to take them if it comes with some merit for doing well in an exam, and parents would be more inclined to take them as a reward as well and if they see a good game the children may just become town fans. That in my opinion, targetting children is the only way to improve attendances as most adults have already chosen their football/rugby club and it's unlikely that anything would cause then to change. Especially when Leeds are in the area.

Leeds are a terrible example who care very little for their fanbase. Harrogate will never be a footballing town however hard Irving tries.

I never said the approach Leeds take as a whole, i used a specific example which was a good idea, might as well not bother trying then. Fold the club now.

It's fascinating only in so far as it demonstrates what contempt macca has for the ordinary supporters who help pay his wages. Sack the ignorant plank. Surprised he could muster a few words without resorting to swearing like he does from the touchline.

Well it stems from the top really as we well know and it is fairly evident that they have all sat around a table to discuss because they all seem to be singing from the same hymn sheet......The board have to be careful here not to drive away their bread and butter!

they did that by not replacing our two best strikers at a crucial time

I'm inclined to agree there probably isn't an answer to this one. Worth saying though that we DID get crowds up to 550 or so during the latter stages of Aspin's regime. I tend to think for a town like Harrogate (older demographic, middle class, a bit 'posh'), you simply won't get more than that in the BSN, and actually it compares well to most 'normal' BSN teams. I don't count teams like Halifax and Chester who are, basically, league clubs passing through. I don't think Guiseley average many more despite their massive success in the league the last few seasons (400/500?).

In the past Ive suggested a kind of publicity blitz in the weeks before the new season starts: handing out leaflets in Harrogate town centre, posters in shops, does Harrogate have a 'free paper'? If so, an insert in there, some kind of voucher scheme etc. etc. It would need volunteers, but I'd be happy to hand out leaflets etc. I'm sure others would.

Even so we shouldn't expect miracles...Harrogate is Harrogate, great town (wished I lived there!), but not really football territory.

For me, it is very simple why the attendances at the CNG arent great.

Harrogate isn't a football town, and I walk through Harrogate Town very often.

Do I see any HTFC flyers? No
Do we see any promotional advertising for HTFC? No

The board really need to sit around the table and have a look at this. We have a supporters club, that when i was involved, came up with a hatful of ideas to improve the attendances, and the reputation of the club.

For example:

Discounted Tickets for a few games (ones that we are expected to get a good result from)
Better Advertising around Harrogate Town
A Spread within the Harrogate Advertiser
Vouchers for discounted entry into the CNG.
Harrigate Town FC Family Days.
Family ticket fixed prices
Merchandise Deals. (20% off with match ticket)
Meet and Greet with the players.

That is just a few ideas, and i'm sure there are loads more. The Supporters Club will have tons of ideas, that's for sure.

I realise that Irving has put a lot of money into the club, but in order for us to go to the next level, you have to speculate to accumulate.

The people are there, as the Hastings/Hinckley attendances have shown, but it is the responsibility of the club to tap into this potential.

We used to have more young fans years ago!
And some of these used to travel to away games on the T.I.T.S buses!
Because the coaches this season have been for “night matches” not many young fans have travelled on them!
But would they travel to away games if there was a coach on a Saturday?
I guess younger fans are happy to stay @ home playing Football Manager nowadays & most parents are unlikely to let their teenage kids travel to away matches unaccompanied!
But the younger fans are where you will increase your attendances for the future so we need to encourage them to come to the matches!!!!

A lot of Parents can't really afford to attend the game. Example. 2 Adults, 2 Children. Using current price structure is £34 quid (i think). Add programmes, food, drinks. You are looking at £50 quid. A lot of families cant afford that. Hence my suggestion about the family discount ticket. £24 quid for a family of 2 adults, 2 children? Thats a more affordable option. £12 quid for an adult and child? (Child free?)

Unfortunately, night coaches will be a bit of a sticky one, as most parents dont want their children out past 10-11pm of an evening, and most adults who have children dont travel due to a multitude of circumstances. Only your hardcore element are going to travel to fixtures on a weeknight evening.

As Big L says, Saturdays would be a better option, unfortunately, the person who was best at arranging transport/establishing communications for transport has resigned.

The club should be aiming at the younger population, maybe if a child picks his ticket up from the ticket office, he gets one free for a friend? Discount child prices?

These are just a few ideas, but if the club is serious about improving attendances, speculate to accumulate.

All good ideas, neil, can't find fault in any of them, although my view is that the club is close to hitting a ceiling which makes it difficult to progress the club any further. Fotherby sensed this was probably the case and decided enough was enough. It's tricky as I'd love to see town in the conference premier but at the same time I don't see how the club could sustain themselves there. The danger is that before long Irving will realise this too. Sorry for the depressing post!

I cant disagree with you to be honest, but to look at it from a different perspective, we have a stadium that can hold over 3000 people. Its been proved that we can fill it, or get a decent attendance, as proved with Hastings and Hinckley.

The pitch has certainly affected matters this season, and I do think that if the pitch matters didnt exist, the league table would make better reading. With regards to next season, if we are doing well in the league, and we go on a cup run and the pitch also holds out, combining those factors with promotions and offers, I do think the club stands a good chance of improving the attendances.

I dont think Irving wouldn't have invested in the club if the potential wasnt there. He could have put his investment elsewhere, but chose Harrogate Town FC. Apart from his son managing the club, he obviously sees something in the club, or he wouldnt have got involved. I really dont think he would have invested just because his son was involved with the club.

i have been watching town on and off since Adam was a lad (the one in the bible) and although we have had some good players over the years we have never had a good team until maybe now, we where run as a local team playing in minor leagues with a pitch and a changing room with supporters who went because there was not a lot to do on a Saturday so it was Town one week and Railway the next both playing as bad as the other, neither clubs had any ambition but there was a lot of clubs like us but someone comes along and has ambition and things change it did for these clubs
Barnet
Morecambe
Dad & Red
Wigan
Yeovil
Crawley
Stevenage
Burton albion
Cheltenham
Fleetwood
Wycome Wanderers

all these teams are now in the football league who would have thought it a few years ago as most have a population smaller or the same has Harrogate, all you need is ambition and a will to succeed it reminds me of a line in that great movie "Field of Dreams" "build it and they will come"

Lots of interesting points, lets not forget a team called AFC Fylde, formerly a village team (still a village team I guess!), who are currently motoring through the leagues, bit like Fleetwood did. Some of these 'ambitious' teams crash and burn however when the guy with the big pockets decides to pull the plug: anyone rembember Colne FC? Truro in the BSS seem to be teetering on the edge, Rushden and Diamonds? etc.etc. Whats happened (is happening) to Northwich Victoria is a painful example of how things can go pear shaped. THe fans, of course, always suffer. FC United (a different ownership model, of course) seem to have got a bit 'stuck' in the Evo-Stik (so to speak .

Like TS I'm a bit concerned about how really committed Irving is to the club, as opposed to his son. He certainly seems to be, a lot of money must have been spent the last year or so. Suggests he is in it for the long haul, lets hope so.

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There is no doubt the pitch has affected the attendances this season!
Matches being moved to midweek & to other ground’s, matches being postponed on “dry days” when every other local side has played!

We went 2 months without playing a match @ the CNG after the Hinckley game on the 15th Dec 2012!!!!!!

Fans got out of the habit of coming down then couldn’t afford 3 home games on the bounce!!!

TV football kills our midweek attendances like a lot of other clubs!
10 of our 21 home league games this season have been MIDWEEK!

Need to keep coming up with ideas on boosting our home support for next season!
It’s going to be a long term project this!
Developing “Hereditary Support”
But you have to keep @ it!

League needs to start earlier (they wont, of course), and get as many league games in by the end of October as possible when the weather is (hopefully!), better, and the 'big' Euro games have not really started on TV. JAn/Feb are desperate months, weather is cold even if games are on, and crowds drop off. Could I suggest also a 7.30 p.m. kick off? Might persuade a few more parents to bring kids etc. Mind you its a selfish suggestion: I could watch the whole game and still get the 9.45 train Come on Mr Weaver sir, only 15 minutes after all!

I known it's completely unrealistic but what i would love is the football calender to change completely. Kick Rugby out of there summer spots and have the football season throughout the summer.

It has its attractions, football in the winter months (if on at all), can be a bit of an ordeal, but then I guess football in the middle of an August heatwave (remember them?) has its problems too. Mind you they play that in the Republic of Ireland. I think I'm old fashioned enough to stick to the August-April model, but fitting more games in earlier.

I do think though that all amateur football including junior should be moved to the summer months, otherwise it just becomes an uphill battle to get games on and the state of the pitches are terrible. No wonder our national team is terrible, growing up playing on a bobbly mess of a pitch.